The Norris Group Blog

Tom Anderson Chairman and Founder of PENSCO Trust Company (Full Bio)

This week Bruce is joined by Tom Anderson. Tom is the chairman and founder of PENSCO Trust Company. He is considered by many to be the national expert on the topic of self directed IRAs. He focuses on how investors can increase their wealth-building potential with real estate and private equity investments. He has written articles for nearly all nations and financial magazines. He was recently invited to Washington as part of the “Future of Finance Initiative” for the Obama Administration.

Tom has been in the banking business for 41 years and in the self-directed investment business for 22. The government is paying more attention to retirement issues, because there is concern over social security. Unfortunately, we are still in the dark ages in regards to knowledge of self directed investments. Many people are surprised by the idea that you can buy mutual funds with your retirement account. Many Americans are unhappy with being locked into their 401Ks, other pension plans, and other IRAs. Those retirement plans only offer a limited range of investments, and most of the options are related to Wall Street, which many people have lost a lot of money on recently. The only commodity that hasn’t taken much damage is gold, but Tom thinks most people didn’t get into Gold until after it had already experienced increases, so gold probably won’t be a good long term investment.

When Tom was in Washington, he was surprised by how interested the government was in hearing about his industry. The Retirement Industry Trust Association, which represents 90% of the self-directed custodians in the U.S., was invited to write a white paper on the need for more diversification in retirement accounts. Unfortunately, many of the government workers that Tom was speaking to before have been replace, so he has some influential ground to recover. He does feel though that the government in general has become more open to new ideas on improving retirement savings. As the president of the RITA, it is Tom’s goal to use any opportunity to discuss retirement issues with the government.

IRAs were created in 1974 as part of the ERISA Act. You could self direct an IRA back then. You could buy real estate in New Zealand if you desired to, but most people weren’t aware of that, because the securities and mutual fund companies began lobbying against real estate as a prudent retirement investment plan.

Real estate is a great long term investment. Real estate generally out paces the stock market on a long term basis. In California, you can buy properties that cashflow. When there is a down turn, it’s a great time to take advantage of real estate and ride the curve up.

Before 1974, there were pension plans but no IRAs. One of the reasons IRAs were created was because trustees were abusing their privileges. The trustees were spending the money they received to buy yachts and they would frequently lose the money given to them. Because of this, the government felt it was necessary to allow people to save on their own.

Self-directed is a frequently misunderstood word. IRAs are IRas regardless of where they are held, and the rules are dictated by the IRS. Depending on where the IRA is held, the custodian may limit what an investor can do with their IRA. There are two types of self-directed IRAs. The first is known as a self-directed brokerage account. With a self-directed brokerage account, you can pick from stocks and mutual funds to invest in, but you cannot invest in real estate or private equity. The other type of IRA allows you to invest in anything permitted by law. Some of Tom’s clients have bought companies in Spain and properties in New Zealand. When you buy outside the country, you have to consider the exchange differences. If the foreign monetary value increases against the U.S. dollar, then you can profit from both the investment and the monetary change.

There is a level of sophistication required to invest in certain categories. Tom encourages people to stick to what they know. If you own a gas station and know about gas as an investment, then you may want to use your IRA to invest in another gas station.

There are some laws regarding who and how you can deal with your IRA. There is that limits one’s ability to work with more than 3 unaccredited investors. In some cases, you cannot work with any unaccredited investors. To be an accredited investor you must have a minimum net worth of $1 million, and at least $200,000 in income for the last two years. The SEC may change their definition of “accredited investor”. Tom believes the requirements for an accredited investor will increase, because many people have lost money in stocks and private equity.

If someone wants to buy a trust deed or rental unit, they are free to do that, even if they only have $80,000 in their account.

Tom believes that IRAs are a great form of capital formation in the U.S. PENSCO started out with no assets and now has $3 billion worth of assets. PENSCO is also now funding thousands of companies that could not be started without IRAs, because they couldn’t get funding from traditional sources. There are about $4 trillion in IRA accounts.

Tom had a client who opened a $300 ROTH IRA. His company charges a $375 fee, so Tom knew the client must have had a plan. The client instructed PENSCO to send a $10 check to a lawyer in order to consummate a real estate option contract. This contract gave them the right for 30 days to buy property from a developer. The developer needed cash for $350,000. While the contract was being negotiated, the client found a buyer for a property for $525,000. Once he took the $525,000 from the buyer, he paid the seller $350,000, and moved the profit into his IRA account.

A ROTH IRA offers tax free growth for life and a great rate of return. One of Tom’s clients started a ROTH IRA with $1,800. This client used his ROTH IRA to develop a successful venture, and in 2002, that client cashed out with $32 million. He then took that $32 million and invested in other start ups. He has now increased his IRA holdings into 9 digit levels. Bruce thinks it is hard to believe that the IRS isn’t suspicious of this kind of tax free profit. Tom explains that this client helped create thousands of jobs. This fortunate client stimulated the economy and created tax revenue. 40% of new jobs are from start ups, and 70% are from small, private companies.

We still have 35 days to take advantage of a one time opportunity. Your IRA is now a portable pension plan, and can be converted into a ROTH IRA regardless of your income. Before 2006, this was not allowed. Before January 2010, if you made more than $100,000, you were prohibited from such conversions. You also have the opportunity this year to do the conversion to ROTH IRA and defer the taxation on the converted amount to 2011 and 2012. This means that if you convert in 2010, then in 2011 you must claim 50% of the converted amount on your income. The other 50% of the 2010 amount must be claimed in 2012. If you are expecting to be in a lower tax bracket in the future, this is a great opportunity for you. The government is very supportive of these conversions, because they get to collect the tax upfront.

If you bought assets that are currently depreciating, and if you have these assets in your IRA, then you can convert to a ROTH IRA and pay tax at a lower amount. This can allow those assets some time to recover. It is much better to convert a depreciated asset than an appreciated asset.

Capital gains rules do not apply within an IRA. When you take money out of an IRA, that money is taxed at a normal rate. However, if you have a ROTH IRA that has existed for 5 years, and if you are at age 59 and a half, then you can take out all your money tax free.

If you have a traditional IRA, at age 70 and a half, you have to take out minimum distributions. However, if you have a ROTH IRA, you can leave the money in the IRA as long as you want, and you can leave it to your children after you have died. There is also no estate tax, because the taxes have already been paid.

The use of leverage to purchase real estate is allowed with a ROTH IRA. It is possible to borrow up to 70% on any income producing property types on an IRA. You must put at least 30% down on the property though, because if the loan is recourse, then you would be self-dealing, which is prohibited. The 70% limit is according to bank policy, and they have had great success with this limit. They have very few foreclosures. Rates for loans are generally two points above prime. Many things can be negotiated as well.

There is actually a rule which allows you to bail out you IRA. If you got a 70% loan on a $100,000 house, and you put $30,000 down with your IRA. If you lose your tenant, and you do not have enough money in your IRA to make the payment, then you would typically be foreclosed on. In this kind of situation, there is a Department of Labor provision called AD-26, which allows you to lend money to your own IRA without limitation, so long as the money is being used to bail out the IRA account.

For more information about The Norris Group’s California hard money loans or our California Trust Deed investments, visit the website or call our office at 951-780-5856 for more information. For upcoming California real estate investor training and events, visit The Norris Group website and our California investor calendar. You’ll also find our award-winning real estate radio show on KTIE 590am at 6pm on Saturdays or you can listen to over 170 podcasts in our free investor radio archive.